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Any ideas? Bad phase

Discussion in 'Your Living Room' started by adominique, Nov 16, 2018.

  1. adominique

    adominique New Member

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    Hi all, I'm having a rough time, thought I'd see if anyone has any suggestions.

    I'm 29, had Meniere's for 21 years, bilateral since my early twenties. Hearing loss fluctuates from mild to moderate. I've got by in the past with occasional vertigo attacks, mostly controlled by betahistine, diet and lifestyle.

    This March I caught flu at work, which caused ear infections, which started the worst phase of my life. I started having bad vertigo attacks which got more frequent until I was having one a day. Signed off work for about 3 months.

    I had a steroid injection in my right ear in July, which, after a terrible week, seemed to do the trick. I slowly started getting better.

    I'm a teacher, so I went back to work in September. After a couple of weeks I caught a cold from one of the children, which started it all off again. I was soon signed off again. Again attacks got more frequent and worse over time. I'm now having about 2 attacks a day, and I can barely move without triggering at least nausea and dizziness, if not a full vertigo attack. I've barely got off the sofa for a week, my partner has to help me move around when I really have to.

    I saw a specialist a couple of weeks ago, who said that he wants to see if things settle themselves before giving me another steroid injection. I have a follow-up appointment with him in February.

    I don't know if I can last that long though, the attacks are hell and last for hours, and between I can't do anything but keep still (and increasingly bored!) on the sofa. Especially if they keep getting worse.

    Has anyone experienced anything like this? I don't know what to do - I've tried all the medications, steroid injections are possible but don't seem to last long, and I'm nervous of more serious treatments/operations as they risk hearing. Also, the majority of my worst attacks are around 4-5am, any ideas? I've tried eating/drinking just before bed, and getting up in the night for a snack and drink. It also seems that colds/flu are now a big trigger, but I don't see how I'm going to avoid them without becoming a recluse!

    Thanks for reading
     
  2. Pupper

    Pupper Active Member

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    Adominique, I can't imagine having MD for as long as you've had it. And bilateral. My heart goes out to you.

    Just a humble opinion from some guy on a forum...but your situation sounds like what they call, "life altering". Serious stuff. Your "specialist" is messing around with steroids, which doesn't have a good success record. And he's asking you to wait months in your condition? Again, I'm just some dude, but if I were in your situation I'd throw on a nightgown and get to a serious vestibular clinic asap.

    Like the House clinic in LA. Or Johns Hopkins back East. Texas has some fine institutions. Florida & Arizona too, where old people with balance issues hang out.

    If you're afraid of surgery after what your life has been like, then I don't know what to say.
     
  3. adominique

    adominique New Member

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    Hi Pupper, thanks for replying. It has been awful. The thing I'm scared of with surgery, is going for it and ending up losing my hearing for the rest of my life when maybe the doctor is right and the vertigo could settle if I can just hold out for a while longer. I am considering asking for a second opinion now though.
     
  4. solari

    solari MM.org Janitor Staff Member

    Admin Post
    I would definitely get second and even third opinions if you can. That's the thing with this type of disease, you want to exhaust all the steps before taking any permanent ones.

    You may also want to check other alternative methods mentioned on the forum here to close the circle.

    Also, since you say your worst attacks occur while sleeping or in bed, you may want to check and see if you have BPPV: BPPV -- Benign Paroxysmal Positional Vertigo

    I certainly hope you find some relief somehow, some way...

    Ray
     
  5. Clare

    Clare Active Member

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    Adominique, your quality of life has gotten to a point where you need to assertively find solutions. You have bilateral mm, which presents significantly more challenges than for those of us who are one-sided. As Pupper suggested above, seek out the best Meniere's specialists you can find and get multiple opinions. You have a lot of life ahead of you, and you need to proactively claim the best quality of life you can have. I would add to the previous recommendations Mayo Clinic Rochester, but because of overwhelming demand for Meniere's treatment, they limit service to residents of Minnesota and the directly surrounding states. Wherever you are located, it's worth getting a consultation at a top clinic, even if there may be some travel involved. Even though to us Meniere's is an everyday thing, it is still a rarity to the average ENT. After seeing one or more specialists, the treatment plan you decide on can probably be worked mostly through your local clinics. Be well.
     
  6. adominique

    adominique New Member

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    Thanks for your replies.

    Solari, I was tested a long time ago for BPPV so I don't think it's that, unless I ended up with both a bad MD phase and a bout of BPPV at the same time. I'll ask the next doctor I see about it though. I don't really know where to start with alternative methods, I've tried several vitamins/supplements in the past and not noticed an effect e.g. ginko, vit C, lysine. I'm allergic to spices so can't try cayenne, turmeric etc. I have bad eczema and contact allergies so can't use essential oils. I've tried acupuncture, electro-acupuncture, massage. I used to take a diuretic but it made my potassium levels tank despite supplements so they took me off it. I don't mean to be so negative, I'm just not sure where to go next - have you had any successes with 'at home' treatments?

    Clare and Pupper, thanks for the recommendations but I'm in the UK. I'm going to look into getting more opinions. I've been living minute-to-minute hoping that things will get better again, but you're right, I need to be more proactive.
     
  7. John of Ohio

    John of Ohio Active Member

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    Regarding susceptibility to colds and flue --- which, of course, can seriously complicate matters in the ear for those of us with Meniere's or related afflictions.

    I, too, was a teacher; exposed to all the colds and flues the kids distributed in class. But I started taking 5000 IU of vitamin D-3 a day (cost of 3 cents), and haven't had a cold or flue in 18 years.

    Many other health benefits from adequate supplementation of vitamin D-3. Virtually all moderns are vitamin D deficient; suppressing the immune system, etc.

    And, no, 2000 IU are insufficient. Take 5000 IU and see what happens. Many good, subtle outcomes, which for some includes better sleep. Before vitamin D, I used to get SAD, seasonal affective disorder; the winter blues (Dec through Mar depression). No more.

    --John of Ohio
     
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  8. PapaJoe

    PapaJoe Member

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    Like Puppet says, life altering.

    For me (another schlub on the interwebz), and for a number of people i've talked to, gut and dental issues are often implicated. No two people ever have the exact same set of symptoms. We're the 'lucky' people who get the MM (Meniere's) symptoms, but you've likely got other health issues.

    Leaky gut (yes, it's real, it's common, and there is plenty of science to back it) happens when your gut microbes get too many of the wrong kind. This damages your gut lining, which allows yeasts/germs/viruses to enter the bloodstream where they take up residence in various parts of the body and wreak long term havoc.
    If you have irregular bowels (sorry, tmi), you likely have gut problems.

    Another common area of infections is in the dental area. If you've ever had bleeding gums, or had gingivitis, or periodontal disease, or ever wore braces or had a mouth injury, you've had situations where again, the oral bacteria/fungi/viruses enter the blood stream, coincidently very close to the vestibular nerves.

    I'm thinking that if you've had long-term sinus problems, then that would be another area where microbes could enter the blood stream, again, close to the vestibular nerves.

    What has worked for some people, and doesn't require a doctor, is to make sure you're on a low carb, wheat free (dairy free if dairy is a problem for you) diet. Google 'Candida diet' or 'alkaline diet'. If this is the right approach for you, you should see some improvement in symptoms in two-three weeks.

    Additionally, get these pre and probiotics - You may already be taking probiotics, and that's fine, keep taking them, but this is new technology - the prebiotics are macrophages, which are cells that seek out and attack the type of microbes that are bad for your gut. The probiotics are a spore form. A probiotic spore will have a better chance of surviving in the gut.
    Home - Tested. Trusted. Dr. Tobias.
    You want to get the "Deep Immune" Deep Immune - Tested. Trusted. Dr. Tobias.
    They are a German company, so until Brexit you should be able to get some. I get mine (US) on Amazon. I have no relationship with the company other than as a very satisfied customer.

    If you've ever had any of the dental risk areas: Root canal, bleeding gums, gingivitis, periodontal disease, wore braces, had a mouth injury, then you're in danger of apical infections. "Apical" means the area around the root of a tooth, but on the outside of the root. Root canal procedures are notoriously unreliable worldwide, they often leave significant pockets of infection. This was my deal. I've had three documented dental apical infections. One was from a 40 year old botched root canal. One was from a 1 year old botched root canal.
    My case is extreme, but if any of that applies to you, ask your dentist to take 3D cone beam images of your mouth, and then, with the software viewer, examine the apical area of each tooth. Any weird looking shaded or lighter areas, even if the dentist doesn't think they're significant, are worthy of a further look.


    Additionally, I know the CBD oil is medically approved for some things in the UK, maybe your doc will give it a try?
    That's been a 'miracle' supplement for keeping the vertigo at bay for me since I discovered it 6 months or so ago. Originally the docs told me to use valium under the tongue. Slow and drowsy. meclizine (less-drowsy dramamine formula) is faster and a bit less drowsy. CBD worked quicker and with none of the drowsiness.

    Good luck!
     
  9. adominique

    adominique New Member

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    Nov 16, 2018
    John, thanks for the suggestion. I currently take 2000IU so I'll try 5000.

    PapaJoe, my teeth are ok but I had constant ear infections as a child, and my left eardrum perforated when I was 7 - a year before my MD started. I eat plant-based, vegan, low carb, low salt, no sugar (other than fruit); I haven't cut out wheat so I'll try that. I've heard of prebiotics, I'll look into it thanks. I'll ask the doctor about CBD oil but I'm wary of it - I tried a CBD vaporiser tested by the NHS, and although it helped with morning brain fog I tried it at the start of a vertigo attack and went straight into the worst attack of my life. It could have been a coincidence but it's made me nervous of trying again. How do you use the oil?
     
  10. PapaJoe

    PapaJoe Member

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    I take the tincture oil a few drops under the tongue. I will say, that if you're right on the edge of an attack, I doubt anything will stop it. If you decide to try it again, take a dose in the morning before symptoms get too bad.

    It's entirely likely that you have biofilm infections in the sinus areas where your ear infections have played out over the years. Look at my Biofilm theory thread for some pictures of biofilm colonies in the sinus areas.

    I'm not sure what to do about it, but it helps to identify the problem first.

    eta: Changed "double" to "doubt"
     
  11. Clare

    Clare Active Member

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    I had trouble with the standard hctz diuretics, but did much better on spironolactone/Aldactone, a potassium-sparing diuretic.

    I wondered at one point whether the diuretic was actually helpful, so cut the dosage in half for a couple of weeks. I had a big surge in vertigo episodes, so went back to my regular dosage (50mg/day), and the vertigo subsided. Like anything with Meniere's, cause and effect is nebulous, but this experience was enough to keep me on 50mg spironolactone for many years.
     
  12. Clare

    Clare Active Member

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    Papa Joe, do you take CBD on a daily basis as a preventative, or do you use it as a rescue medicine at the first sign of a vertigo attack? I'm confused about how it is used to be beneficial.
     
  13. PapaJoe

    PapaJoe Member

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    Daily as a preventative, and more if I'm feeling wonky.

    I'm not sure how the attacks go with you, but I can tell when I get up if it's going to be a steady day or an unsteady day, with unsteady days being liable for an attack. On unsteady days I take more.
     
  14. AnneT

    AnneT Well-Known Member

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    Good info here. How’s it going now Clare? Do you have good rescue meds (Ativan sublingual is fast)?

    I’m on 5000 vitamin d for osteopenia but just realize my SAD is not bad so far this winter!

    See my signature to see all the stuff I’m trying. I think a huge component is our barometric chaos here in calybut I’ll try Eve short of surgery before considering a geographic experiment.

    Keep researching Keep us posted on what’s working or not.
     
  15. justsaiyan

    justsaiyan Member

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    Hey adominique,

    How are you doing? Any luck finding a good ENT?

    Hope your symptoms have improved a bit (or alot)!

    Kind regards
     
  16. JulieZ

    JulieZ New Member

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    Hi adominique, I am so sorry to hear you are going through this. One question and one suggestion. The question is, have you tried the antivirals route? Given that your symptoms are so triggered by viral issues, it would seem to make sense to try antiviral medication to see if you are one of the people it helps. Second, I used to get colds and hear infections every year until I upped my Zinc intake. You don't want to go crazy with it, it will make you nauseous if you take too much. But I take a calcium supplement (Advacal) that has a small amount included, and I take an extra 25 mg a day at the very first sign of a cold. I've been doing this for some years now and have been far less sick than I was before.
     
  17. Clare

    Clare Active Member

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    Anne, thanks for asking. I'm doing very well now after laby surgery in August. I have no fears of vertigo or nausea, can eat what I like, don't have to carry rescue meds, have a more hopeful outlook, etc. The surgery was truly life-changing for me.
     
  18. AnneT

    AnneT Well-Known Member

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    That’s great to hear. Wow. I still want to avoid surgery if I can... but good to know it can be a positive game changer!
     

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